Episode 7 | Care | TBN

Episode 7 | Care

Watch Episode 7 | Care
October 16, 2018
26:33

Jesus the Game Changer

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Episode 7 | Care

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  • - The belief that there is a God
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  • like the one that Jesus taught of
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  • who says that the most pain filled,
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  • most disabled, most hurting human being,
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  • carries the image of God and it's an ennobling thing
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  • to sacrifice for them.
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  • Well, you know, there's dynamite in that.
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  • (upbeat music)
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  • - There's one particular story of Jesus's care for people,
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  • which is really important because three
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  • of the people who write the story of Jesus's life
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  • Matthew, Mark, and Luke all this story.
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  • It's about a guy called Jairus who in a public setting,
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  • and he was a synagogue ruler comes to see Jesus
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  • and says my daughter's dying, can you help.
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  • So Jesus, walking through the crowd,
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  • with obviously people following,
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  • heads to Jairus' house.
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  • On the way, an anonymous woman,
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  • who for 12 years had been suffering from a bleed,
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  • which meant that she was ceremonially unclean,
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  • who wanted desperately to be healed
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  • thought that if I just touched the corner of his garment.
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  • She reaches out and touches him.
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  • Jesus feels something happening,
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  • and he said who touched me.
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  • And they're all saying,
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  • are you kidding, there's people everywhere.
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  • Jesus said, no who touched me,
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  • and the woman comes forward
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  • that she'd spent all this money on doctors
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  • and no one could help her.
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  • And Jesus says you're healed.
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  • Jesus cares for Jairus as a wealthy,
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  • influential, public individual and goes home
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  • and heals his daughter.
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  • Jesus also heals the marginalized anonymous woman
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  • who was desperate for help.
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  • Healing and care is for everybody.
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  • Jesus's love is for the wealthy and the poor.
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  • The influential and the marginalized.
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  • Care is for all people.
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  • - We tend to assume, secular or not,
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  • that love needs to be part of our equation.
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  • And I would say Jesus brought in a language,
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  • expectations, a way of thinking about love,
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  • a way of thinking about freedom.
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  • Take Jesus out of the equation,
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  • this is not just a world that's a little bit different,
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  • it's a world that's pretty much not recognizable.
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  • Because I think he's impacted us so profoundly
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  • and so deeply in ways we just do not understand.
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  • - No, people are staggered.
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  • I mean, you look at the ancient sources,
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  • again I'm a historian.
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  • And they just marvel at how these Christians live.
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  • They say if the poor arrive, they bring them in.
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  • I mean, it's a great challenge now for us
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  • with the migrant crisis.
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  • You know, they give them shelter.
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  • They bury not only their own dead
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  • but other people's dead.
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  • They care for them.
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  • I mean, people were staggered.
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  • And of course, the word behind this
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  • is this word agape, which is love for the unlovely.
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  • The Roman world hadn't heard of it.
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  • It was coined by, with the Christian church emerging.
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  • Because people would say,
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  • well how do you explain this love for the unlovely.
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  • Well only because Jesus at the cross
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  • dies for the unlovely, his followers serve the unlovely.
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  • And so, that's this transformational thing.
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  • - But it is to say there's nothing about
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  • atheism or secularism or the idea that
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  • the material world is all that exists
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  • that says there is a dignity and worth
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  • to suffering or dying people
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  • that I ought to sacrifice myself for.
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  • But the belief that there is a God
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  • like the one that Jesus taught of
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  • who says that the most pain filled,
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  • most disabled, most hurting human being,
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  • carries the image of God
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  • and that it's an ennobling thing to sacrifice for them.
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  • Well, you know, there's dynamite in that
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  • that has moved people for many many centuries
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  • to be willing to sacrifice themselves
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  • for the sake of folks that in the ancient world
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  • were just put on the dung heap.
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  • - It was a worldview of unconditional love
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  • and radical tolerance that we see
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  • Jesus preaching in Luke six.
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  • You know, do good to those who don't do good to you.
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  • Love your enemies.
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  • And this sort of teaching was just, it was revolutionary.
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  • Jesus even mentions you have heard it said
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  • love your neighbor and hate your enemy.
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  • And isn't that the way of the world?
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  • But he comes back and says but I tell you,
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  • love your enemies, do good to those who hate you,
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  • who persecute you, who don't do good to you.
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  • And the reason that this is so important
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  • and the reason why I think it spread
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  • is because that is acceptance,
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  • that's unconditional love.
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  • - [Interviewer] John, what's your background.
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  • - [John] My background is in nursing
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  • before I came in to theology.
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  • I nursed as a mental health nurse for 16 years.
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  • - Wow.
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  • Just from that background,
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  • as we think about the Greco Roman world,
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  • the world that Jesus stepped into,
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  • how did they deal with say
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  • people with mental illnesses or disabilities.
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  • - Well, the world would be a very dark place
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  • for people who were unable to produce,
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  • who were experiencing disability.
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  • Because the way in which people valued one another
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  • within that context related to what they could do.
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  • So it's a kind of a utilitarian context
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  • where even children were only valued
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  • in terms of what they could do when they grow up.
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  • - Yeah.
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  • - And so the bottom line would be that
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  • disabled children would be killed,
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  • they'd be put in a hill and they'd be exposed.
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  • - Wow, just left outside.
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  • - Just left outside.
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  • Likewise for elderly people, you know,
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  • there would be no social care because they can't produce
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  • they would be contestablely useless.
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  • - Rodney, what was it that Jesus taught
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  • that the early church picked up on
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  • that kind of shifted.
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  • - I suppose the main thing he taught
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  • is that life was sacred.
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  • That the life of everyone.
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  • That people were to take care of one another,
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  • that we were our brother's keepers.
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  • That we had a responsibility to look
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  • after the old and the young
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  • and the disabled and the ill.
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  • You know, they showed up incredibly
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  • during the two great plagues that hit the Roman Empire
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  • very early in Christian days.
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  • The wealthy Romans fled the cities when it happened,
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  • including the physicians and the priests.
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  • The Christians stayed.
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  • They nursed the ill, took care of people,
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  • and as a consequence some of them died
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  • of the plague of course.
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  • But Christians survived the plague at a much higher rate,
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  • because as a matter of fact,
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  • if you give people food and water and care for them
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  • during the height of their illness,
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  • many of them will survive.
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  • And so there it was apparent
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  • to all of these pagan neighbors
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  • that the Christians were outliving them.
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  • (contemplative music)
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  • - So in antiquity there was no,
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  • and when I say antiquity I mean classic Rome,
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  • there was no welfare state, right,
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  • that's a modern invention.
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  • So, if you were sick and you were poor,
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  • you were in trouble, basically.
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  • If you were a traveler, if you were a foreigner,
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  • and you ran out of money or you got robbed or something,
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  • you were in trouble.
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  • And it was the Christians
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  • who tried to do something about this.
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  • And that really goes back to the Old Testament,
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  • you know, the Hebrew Bible is full of stuff
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  • about looking after the poor, widows,
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  • you know those who need help.
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  • That was really a very Jewish concept
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  • that was largely alien to the classical world.
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  • I mean not entirely, you know, people won't horrible.
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  • But the idea that you had a sort of specific
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  • moral and religious duty to look after the poor
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  • was quite a Jewish innovation,
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  • and the Christians took that over.
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  • - Jesus taught that value is intrinsic.
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  • That it wasn't for what you could do
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  • that you were valued by the Father.
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  • Just simply for who you are, isn't it.
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  • And he really very subtly, and sometimes quite gently,
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  • transformed a whole society.
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  • In the sense that you know for example,
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  • taking a child, holding it up as a paradigm of the kingdom
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  • is absolutely profound.
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  • This child who society would destroy, he says,
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  • you look at this child you see something of
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  • what the world's about,
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  • what the maker and creator of the universe is about.
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  • Likewise, his relationships with women
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  • were quite transformative.
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  • Women were considered to be chattels, property,
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  • but he communes with them.
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  • He allows women to do things
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  • that no other rabbi would do.
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  • - It was the essence of the Christian lifestyle
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  • that people care for one another
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  • and look after one another.
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  • And that there's this much greater sense
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  • of an intimate community.
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  • A community of believers,
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  • but then a community of people who gave money every month
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  • to take care of widows and orphans and what not.
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  • In a world that had no social services,
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  • there was a Roman emperor somewhat later,
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  • Julian the Apostate, who said,
  • 00:10:01.180 --> 00:10:05.140
  • who wrote to the pagan temples and said
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  • you've got to start looking after the sick people
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  • and the poor, because these Christians are doing that,
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  • and they're doing it just, of course,
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  • to out do us and make us look bad.
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  • It was nothing the idea
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  • that they were doing it out of virtue.
  • 00:10:23.220 --> 00:10:25.250
  • But of course, his directions to the temples went nowhere
  • 00:10:25.250 --> 00:10:30.240
  • because there was no base for it,
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  • there was nothing in the pagan traditions
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  • about giving money to the poor.
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  • I'm sure there were Romans that cared about one another,
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  • I mean obviously you know people do.
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  • But it wasn't built into the system.
  • 00:10:47.170 --> 00:10:50.180
  • It wasn't part of the thing that everybody
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  • was raised believing.
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  • And the fact that we have these views in the west
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  • is because we were raised in these traditions,
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  • in these views.
  • 00:11:03.190 --> 00:11:05.050
  • And of course, some of this came from the Judaeo tradition
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  • within which Jesus arose.
  • 00:11:09.140 --> 00:11:12.040
  • It's of course the secret of the West.
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  • - [Interviewer] Where in the world is the church reflecting
  • 00:11:15.280 --> 00:11:18.030
  • that attitude of Jesus.
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  • - One of the most remarkable passages
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  • is when in John's gospel Jesus says
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  • I no longer call you servants, I call you friends.
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  • The maker and creator of the universe
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  • says you are my friend.
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  • And then he says, as long as you do what I command you.
  • 00:11:31.140 --> 00:11:33.270
  • And then later on he says,
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  • well what do I command you to do?
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  • To love one another.
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  • You know, as people can embody that and see that
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  • then we're into a different game.
  • 00:11:40.140 --> 00:11:42.070
  • - We're here in India outside the Mercy Home.
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  • And the Mercy Home is where
  • 00:11:54.280 --> 00:11:56.260
  • Christians are taking people with mental illness
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  • off the street and giving them an opportunity
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  • for safety and a future.
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  • It's another example of the Christian church
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  • serving those in need.
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  • A generation ago, Malcolm Muggeridge came here to India
  • 00:12:06.290 --> 00:12:09.280
  • and he met Mother Teresa.
  • 00:12:09.280 --> 00:12:11.120
  • Now, Malcolm Muggeridge was an internationally known
  • 00:12:11.120 --> 00:12:13.190
  • journalist, an author, he was a skeptic,
  • 00:12:13.190 --> 00:12:15.210
  • he was a Communist sympathizer.
  • 00:12:15.210 --> 00:12:18.080
  • When he came and saw the life and work of Mother Teresa,
  • 00:12:18.080 --> 00:12:22.050
  • he was changed personally. In fact, he wrote that there are
  • 00:12:22.050 --> 00:12:24.290
  • no humanists in leprosarians.
  • 00:12:24.290 --> 00:12:27.100
  • In other words, the people motivated to help those in need
  • 00:12:27.100 --> 00:12:30.220
  • were actually Christian leaders.
  • 00:12:30.220 --> 00:12:33.070
  • Mother Teresa changed Malcolm Muggeridge's life.
  • 00:12:33.070 --> 00:12:36.290
  • It's an example about how the church
  • 00:12:36.290 --> 00:12:39.120
  • has cared for those in need.
  • 00:12:39.120 --> 00:12:41.210
  • We kinda think it's just basic,
  • 00:12:42.180 --> 00:12:44.030
  • that humanity just basically cares for people in need,
  • 00:12:44.030 --> 00:12:46.210
  • but that's not actually the case.
  • 00:12:46.210 --> 00:12:48.210
  • It's actually the teaching of Jesus and the early church
  • 00:12:48.210 --> 00:12:52.150
  • that helped humanity get a grip
  • 00:12:52.150 --> 00:12:54.260
  • to care for those who are marginalized,
  • 00:12:54.260 --> 00:12:57.090
  • the poor, and the most needy.
  • 00:12:57.090 --> 00:12:59.120
  • (contemplative music)
  • 00:13:03.120 --> 00:13:06.170
  • So Jossy give me a picture of
  • 00:13:10.250 --> 00:13:12.030
  • the vision for the ministry here in India.
  • 00:13:12.030 --> 00:13:14.210
  • - Our specific goal is to see 100.000
  • 00:13:15.270 --> 00:13:19.090
  • villages and communities being transformed in this way.
  • 00:13:19.090 --> 00:13:22.140
  • So far, we have about 19.000 villages and communities
  • 00:13:23.260 --> 00:13:28.120
  • being transformed by over seven and a half thousand
  • 00:13:29.260 --> 00:13:32.290
  • full time workers that is working with us.
  • 00:13:32.290 --> 00:13:35.160
  • And they're engaged in seeing churches planted
  • 00:13:35.160 --> 00:13:39.040
  • and schools established.
  • 00:13:39.040 --> 00:13:42.030
  • Orphans, widows cared for.
  • 00:13:42.030 --> 00:13:44.070
  • Young men and women given skills.
  • 00:13:44.070 --> 00:13:46.260
  • Prostitutes being rehabilitated and given new skills
  • 00:13:46.260 --> 00:13:50.090
  • in tailoring and embroidery.
  • 00:13:50.090 --> 00:13:52.110
  • And water wells being dug and toilets being built,
  • 00:13:52.110 --> 00:13:56.140
  • and clean up villages.
  • 00:13:56.140 --> 00:13:58.170
  • Particularly caring for mentally ill people.
  • 00:13:58.170 --> 00:14:01.280
  • In a holistic way, taking care of
  • 00:14:01.280 --> 00:14:04.050
  • every needs of the society.
  • 00:14:04.050 --> 00:14:06.190
  • Like in the book of Acts,
  • 00:14:06.190 --> 00:14:08.000
  • there was no needs among them.
  • 00:14:08.000 --> 00:14:10.060
  • - [Interviewer] So Jossy, you grew up in India.
  • 00:14:14.050 --> 00:14:15.290
  • Tell us a little bit about
  • 00:14:15.290 --> 00:14:17.060
  • what life was like for you growing up.
  • 00:14:17.060 --> 00:14:19.050
  • - I grew up in southern India in a very remote village
  • 00:14:19.050 --> 00:14:22.150
  • on a dirt road with no names.
  • 00:14:22.150 --> 00:14:25.020
  • I was taken care of by my grandfather,
  • 00:14:25.020 --> 00:14:27.010
  • as my father had some mental illness.
  • 00:14:27.010 --> 00:14:29.230
  • And growing up with that kind of stigma,
  • 00:14:29.230 --> 00:14:31.270
  • people knew, you know you're the son of a crazy mad man.
  • 00:14:31.270 --> 00:14:35.290
  • And they would say you're going to be one of those,
  • 00:14:35.290 --> 00:14:37.270
  • and lots of bad nicknames and all of that.
  • 00:14:37.270 --> 00:14:41.100
  • So, from a young age my grandfather used to say,
  • 00:14:41.100 --> 00:14:44.090
  • you know son you need to think about getting out of here.
  • 00:14:44.090 --> 00:14:47.270
  • - And, you ended up in Australia.
  • 00:14:47.270 --> 00:14:49.280
  • - Yeah.
  • 00:14:49.280 --> 00:14:50.230
  • I heard about this amazing country.
  • 00:14:52.140 --> 00:14:54.200
  • I wanted to be like my grandfather,
  • 00:14:54.200 --> 00:14:56.160
  • you know, be a great successful businessman,
  • 00:14:56.160 --> 00:14:59.160
  • and thought that would be a great place to, you know,
  • 00:14:59.160 --> 00:15:02.280
  • start my dream.
  • 00:15:02.280 --> 00:15:05.090
  • So I convinced him to buy me a ticket.
  • 00:15:05.090 --> 00:15:08.110
  • He said he would buy only one way ticket,
  • 00:15:08.110 --> 00:15:10.130
  • because then the rest you have to make it on your own.
  • 00:15:11.260 --> 00:15:14.050
  • And I said, that's good enough.
  • 00:15:14.050 --> 00:15:15.250
  • So when I was about 17 I bought a one way ticket
  • 00:15:15.250 --> 00:15:19.090
  • and came to Australia with a big dream.
  • 00:15:19.090 --> 00:15:22.090
  • - When you were here, it took you awhile
  • 00:15:22.090 --> 00:15:24.080
  • to actually find something.
  • 00:15:24.080 --> 00:15:25.140
  • You were close to starving, weren't you?
  • 00:15:25.140 --> 00:15:27.200
  • - Well, when I landed in Australia with this big dream
  • 00:15:27.200 --> 00:15:31.260
  • and big ideas and had a guy that I was, you know,
  • 00:15:31.260 --> 00:15:36.090
  • connected in the business,
  • 00:15:36.090 --> 00:15:37.150
  • we had a business idea.
  • 00:15:37.150 --> 00:15:38.290
  • So invested the little money I had with him,
  • 00:15:38.290 --> 00:15:41.280
  • but then he went broke.
  • 00:15:41.280 --> 00:15:43.110
  • So then I had no friends, no family, no money,
  • 00:15:44.220 --> 00:15:47.100
  • no ticket to return, and I was stuck.
  • 00:15:47.100 --> 00:15:50.040
  • And became very depressed,
  • 00:15:50.040 --> 00:15:51.250
  • suicidal thoughts started to come.
  • 00:15:53.230 --> 00:15:57.020
  • And then I decided to actually end my life
  • 00:15:57.020 --> 00:15:59.070
  • because you know coming home wasn't an option.
  • 00:15:59.070 --> 00:16:02.030
  • There was no point to live there.
  • 00:16:03.120 --> 00:16:05.070
  • So I actually was on the top of a building,
  • 00:16:06.180 --> 00:16:09.230
  • in Perth, western Australia,
  • 00:16:09.230 --> 00:16:11.180
  • and decided I'm going to jump and die.
  • 00:16:11.180 --> 00:16:14.090
  • But before I did that, I knew about God,
  • 00:16:17.140 --> 00:16:21.090
  • that God was there,
  • 00:16:21.090 --> 00:16:22.220
  • but never really knew him personally.
  • 00:16:22.220 --> 00:16:25.090
  • So I decided to just cry out and say,
  • 00:16:25.090 --> 00:16:27.120
  • well if you are there, if you are real, this is your chance.
  • 00:16:27.120 --> 00:16:30.220
  • And I'm so glad that I did that.
  • 00:16:30.220 --> 00:16:32.180
  • - Yeah.
  • 00:16:32.180 --> 00:16:33.250
  • What did you feel at that moment,
  • 00:16:33.250 --> 00:16:34.230
  • was there some presence of God?
  • 00:16:34.230 --> 00:16:36.030
  • - Initially I didn't feel anything.
  • 00:16:36.030 --> 00:16:38.130
  • I just simply looked up to the sky
  • 00:16:38.130 --> 00:16:40.090
  • and said if you are there, you know, help me,
  • 00:16:40.090 --> 00:16:43.280
  • this is your chance.
  • 00:16:43.280 --> 00:16:45.100
  • And then as I waited, something extraordinary happened.
  • 00:16:45.100 --> 00:16:48.170
  • I was just so overpowered by this presence of God,
  • 00:16:48.170 --> 00:16:52.290
  • and then I fell down and went to this deep sleep
  • 00:16:52.290 --> 00:16:55.220
  • on the roof of this building.
  • 00:16:55.220 --> 00:16:57.200
  • I have no idea how long I slept for,
  • 00:16:57.200 --> 00:16:59.190
  • but when I woke up all that depressive
  • 00:16:59.190 --> 00:17:03.070
  • negative thought was gone.
  • 00:17:03.070 --> 00:17:04.270
  • And there was this unbelievable peace
  • 00:17:04.270 --> 00:17:07.290
  • and a sense that everything is going to be well.
  • 00:17:07.290 --> 00:17:11.020
  • And then I said, God I think you are there.
  • 00:17:11.020 --> 00:17:15.190
  • And I said, you can have me, I surrender my life to you.
  • 00:17:17.030 --> 00:17:19.150
  • - Wow.
  • 00:17:19.150 --> 00:17:20.220
  • - And I heard this little voice to say,
  • 00:17:20.220 --> 00:17:22.170
  • son, you are mine.
  • 00:17:22.170 --> 00:17:24.070
  • - [Interviewer] Jossy it's great to have peace,
  • 00:17:28.290 --> 00:17:30.110
  • but you also needed a job.
  • 00:17:30.110 --> 00:17:32.080
  • - Yeah, absolutely, I mean.
  • 00:17:32.080 --> 00:17:33.200
  • - What happened?
  • 00:17:33.200 --> 00:17:35.020
  • - I mean, incredibly for three months
  • 00:17:35.020 --> 00:17:36.290
  • I was searching for a job.
  • 00:17:36.290 --> 00:17:38.130
  • Anything, I mean you know, clean toilet,
  • 00:17:38.130 --> 00:17:40.270
  • serving restaurant, washing,
  • 00:17:40.270 --> 00:17:42.160
  • but I couldn't get anything.
  • 00:17:42.160 --> 00:17:44.050
  • But that day I walked out of that building
  • 00:17:44.050 --> 00:17:46.270
  • and walked into a factory.
  • 00:17:46.270 --> 00:17:49.230
  • It's a very small little factory, knocked on the door,
  • 00:17:49.230 --> 00:17:52.220
  • and a man came out with his big mustache
  • 00:17:52.220 --> 00:17:55.270
  • and said my name is Claude,
  • 00:17:55.270 --> 00:17:57.150
  • and what can I do for you?
  • 00:17:57.150 --> 00:17:58.200
  • I said I need a job.
  • 00:17:58.200 --> 00:17:59.260
  • He said, come in.
  • 00:17:59.260 --> 00:18:01.070
  • And literally that day I got my job.
  • 00:18:01.070 --> 00:18:04.070
  • And that's the only job I've ever had in my life.
  • 00:18:04.070 --> 00:18:06.240
  • And it wasn't just even a job.
  • 00:18:08.030 --> 00:18:09.200
  • He really took me in as part of his family.
  • 00:18:09.200 --> 00:18:13.020
  • - So you grew into the role, Jossy.
  • 00:18:13.020 --> 00:18:15.050
  • You started at the bottom, but you grew into the company.
  • 00:18:15.050 --> 00:18:17.160
  • - Yeah, absolutely.
  • 00:18:17.160 --> 00:18:19.020
  • Initially my job was cleaning the floor of a blast freezer.
  • 00:18:19.020 --> 00:18:22.010
  • But then grew into supervisor and manager
  • 00:18:23.050 --> 00:18:26.170
  • and director and partner.
  • 00:18:26.170 --> 00:18:28.030
  • And I thought well, retire by the time I was 30 is my goal.
  • 00:18:28.030 --> 00:18:32.060
  • And finally we were able to do that.
  • 00:18:32.060 --> 00:18:35.000
  • So were looking at Tasmania
  • 00:18:35.260 --> 00:18:38.000
  • to have a hobby farm and raise my family
  • 00:18:38.000 --> 00:18:40.220
  • and enjoy life, that was my dream.
  • 00:18:40.220 --> 00:18:42.190
  • - But you're nowhere near retirement, or Tasmania actually.
  • 00:18:42.190 --> 00:18:45.280
  • (laughing)
  • 00:18:45.280 --> 00:18:47.120
  • So what was the passion and vision for India,
  • 00:18:47.120 --> 00:18:50.130
  • how did that come?
  • 00:18:50.130 --> 00:18:51.230
  • - It wasn't so much about passion for India
  • 00:18:51.230 --> 00:18:53.080
  • but more about begin to ask me the question why I am here.
  • 00:18:53.080 --> 00:18:56.170
  • What is the purpose.
  • 00:18:57.270 --> 00:18:59.280
  • So God saved my life and you know
  • 00:18:59.280 --> 00:19:02.200
  • helped me with employment and money
  • 00:19:02.200 --> 00:19:04.240
  • and now I go and live in the hobby farm
  • 00:19:04.240 --> 00:19:07.220
  • and then die and go to heaven.
  • 00:19:07.220 --> 00:19:09.210
  • So what's the purpose of living life here?
  • 00:19:09.210 --> 00:19:12.070
  • And ultimately I found that purpose.
  • 00:19:12.070 --> 00:19:16.270
  • And that I had really two deep convictions.
  • 00:19:16.270 --> 00:19:21.040
  • One was that the purpose for any Christian
  • 00:19:21.040 --> 00:19:23.180
  • to live is to fulfill the Great Commission.
  • 00:19:23.180 --> 00:19:26.240
  • And second was that we must give the opportunity
  • 00:19:26.240 --> 00:19:31.140
  • to share the Gospel with people who have never heard,
  • 00:19:31.140 --> 00:19:34.240
  • or at least an opportunity to hear.
  • 00:19:34.240 --> 00:19:36.130
  • And the third is that we must help
  • 00:19:36.130 --> 00:19:39.180
  • those that are at the bottom
  • 00:19:39.180 --> 00:19:41.220
  • of the social economic chain.
  • 00:19:41.220 --> 00:19:44.100
  • And so when we looked around the world,
  • 00:19:44.100 --> 00:19:46.100
  • incredibly found that this part of the world
  • 00:19:46.100 --> 00:19:49.150
  • has the largest group of people
  • 00:19:49.150 --> 00:19:50.270
  • who never heard the Gospel.
  • 00:19:50.270 --> 00:19:52.190
  • Second, it has the largest poor people.
  • 00:19:52.190 --> 00:19:55.160
  • Six of the north India state
  • 00:19:55.160 --> 00:19:57.250
  • has more poor people than all of Africa put together.
  • 00:19:57.250 --> 00:20:01.170
  • And then of course the car system
  • 00:20:01.170 --> 00:20:03.210
  • and you know electricity and the socioeconomic
  • 00:20:04.270 --> 00:20:08.150
  • and injustice that is taking place,
  • 00:20:08.150 --> 00:20:10.280
  • I felt compelled to do something about it.
  • 00:20:10.280 --> 00:20:12.260
  • And Paul says my ambition is to preach Christ
  • 00:20:12.260 --> 00:20:16.040
  • to those who have never heard it before.
  • 00:20:16.040 --> 00:20:18.040
  • And looking at the book of Acts and the early church,
  • 00:20:18.040 --> 00:20:21.230
  • you know they were sharing Gospel, making disciples,
  • 00:20:21.230 --> 00:20:25.000
  • and they were helping the widows and the orphans
  • 00:20:25.000 --> 00:20:28.000
  • to such a level there was no needs among them.
  • 00:20:28.000 --> 00:20:30.090
  • - So how did caring for anybody that was in any need
  • 00:20:32.100 --> 00:20:35.140
  • function in India when you have basic inequality.
  • 00:20:35.140 --> 00:20:38.230
  • So what would happen to someone in need in India.
  • 00:20:38.230 --> 00:20:41.180
  • - Well, hat's where the practical conflict
  • 00:20:41.180 --> 00:20:44.210
  • between the Gospel and the Hindu culture got going.
  • 00:20:44.210 --> 00:20:49.040
  • The iconic case is the widow burning.
  • 00:20:49.040 --> 00:20:52.200
  • That here is a young woman
  • 00:20:53.170 --> 00:20:56.000
  • that was one of my most important public fights in India.
  • 00:20:56.000 --> 00:20:59.120
  • In 1987 an 18 year old widow in Rajasthan in Sikar
  • 00:20:59.120 --> 00:21:04.140
  • had committed sati, was forced to burn herself
  • 00:21:05.190 --> 00:21:09.140
  • on her husband's funeral fire.
  • 00:21:09.140 --> 00:21:12.060
  • And I went there and investigated it
  • 00:21:12.060 --> 00:21:14.180
  • and wrote the story which published
  • 00:21:14.180 --> 00:21:16.290
  • in the Indian Express's front page story,
  • 00:21:16.290 --> 00:21:20.270
  • the revival of widow burning.
  • 00:21:20.270 --> 00:21:22.280
  • And we got, the media was supporting me.
  • 00:21:22.280 --> 00:21:26.290
  • So finally the government supported that program.
  • 00:21:26.290 --> 00:21:30.110
  • The interesting thing was while we were able to mobilize
  • 00:21:30.110 --> 00:21:34.210
  • 400 intellectuals, intelligentsia, feminists
  • 00:21:34.210 --> 00:21:38.220
  • here in Delhi to oppose widow burning,
  • 00:21:38.220 --> 00:21:42.130
  • the Hindu's in Rajasthan were able to mobilize
  • 00:21:42.130 --> 00:21:47.040
  • 200.000 people demanding that the ban on sati,
  • 00:21:47.040 --> 00:21:51.200
  • the ban on widow burning should be abolished.
  • 00:21:51.200 --> 00:21:54.080
  • And we don't need to go into the details of that incident,
  • 00:21:57.250 --> 00:22:01.020
  • but that is just a case that
  • 00:22:02.000 --> 00:22:05.210
  • Hinduism couldn't even care,
  • 00:22:05.210 --> 00:22:08.200
  • this is upper caste Hindus,
  • 00:22:08.200 --> 00:22:10.120
  • they couldn't even care for a helpless widow.
  • 00:22:10.120 --> 00:22:13.250
  • She's just lost her husband,
  • 00:22:13.250 --> 00:22:15.170
  • she may have little children.
  • 00:22:15.170 --> 00:22:17.270
  • She needs all the love and support and care.
  • 00:22:17.270 --> 00:22:20.280
  • But you see her as a problem,
  • 00:22:20.280 --> 00:22:23.160
  • and you want to solve that problem
  • 00:22:23.160 --> 00:22:25.190
  • by eliminating the problem.
  • 00:22:25.190 --> 00:22:27.160
  • Burn her.
  • 00:22:27.160 --> 00:22:29.000
  • So, there wasn't the culture of care and compassion,
  • 00:22:29.000 --> 00:22:33.230
  • because when you don't affirm the intrinsic
  • 00:22:33.230 --> 00:22:38.160
  • dignity of every individual,
  • 00:22:38.160 --> 00:22:40.110
  • the value of every individual.
  • 00:22:42.020 --> 00:22:44.130
  • And that problem is compounded by the fact
  • 00:22:46.030 --> 00:22:50.090
  • that when you believe in reincarnation,
  • 00:22:50.090 --> 00:22:53.110
  • you have trivialized death.
  • 00:22:53.110 --> 00:22:55.220
  • So when of our gods, (speaking in foreign language)
  • 00:22:55.220 --> 00:22:59.140
  • the sacred scripture he is saying
  • 00:22:59.140 --> 00:23:02.040
  • nobody dies, death is an illusion.
  • 00:23:03.170 --> 00:23:07.010
  • There was never a time when you were not there
  • 00:23:07.010 --> 00:23:09.050
  • and I wasn't there and
  • 00:23:09.050 --> 00:23:10.210
  • there will never be a time when we will not be there.
  • 00:23:10.210 --> 00:23:12.280
  • So, death is only changing clothes.
  • 00:23:12.280 --> 00:23:15.240
  • Like we change clothes, soul changes bodies.
  • 00:23:15.240 --> 00:23:20.160
  • - Is there opposition to your groups
  • 00:23:20.160 --> 00:23:22.200
  • and what you're trying to do in this area.
  • 00:23:22.200 --> 00:23:25.120
  • - Unfortunately yes.
  • 00:23:25.120 --> 00:23:27.160
  • But, majority of the people are so supportive.
  • 00:23:27.160 --> 00:23:30.270
  • I mean you know, we have Hindus, Muslims,
  • 00:23:30.270 --> 00:23:33.190
  • Sikhs and Jains and all people of other faiths
  • 00:23:33.190 --> 00:23:37.000
  • supporting financially and helping what we do.
  • 00:23:37.000 --> 00:23:40.070
  • So, I think you know, we don't want to label
  • 00:23:40.070 --> 00:23:43.170
  • different religious groups or society in general.
  • 00:23:43.170 --> 00:23:46.060
  • But unfortunately there is right wing extreme groups
  • 00:23:46.060 --> 00:23:50.260
  • who are opposed to the kind of thing we are doing.
  • 00:23:50.260 --> 00:23:54.240
  • You know, including one of the schools that we had
  • 00:23:54.240 --> 00:23:58.260
  • for educating some of the untouchable kids,
  • 00:23:58.260 --> 00:24:02.290
  • they tried to demolish it, a number of times.
  • 00:24:02.290 --> 00:24:07.010
  • The reason they do not want us to educate those kids.
  • 00:24:07.010 --> 00:24:11.140
  • Because if those kids get educated
  • 00:24:11.140 --> 00:24:13.130
  • then they're going to have a better life and job.
  • 00:24:13.130 --> 00:24:15.180
  • They're not going to do those slave jobs anymore.
  • 00:24:15.180 --> 00:24:19.220
  • In my own team we have thousands of people,
  • 00:24:19.220 --> 00:24:22.190
  • and they are all great game changers,
  • 00:24:22.190 --> 00:24:26.130
  • but in different ways.
  • 00:24:26.130 --> 00:24:28.090
  • Some are caring for the kids
  • 00:24:28.090 --> 00:24:30.080
  • and some are doing the cleaning.
  • 00:24:30.080 --> 00:24:32.090
  • I believe that all of us care.
  • 00:24:32.090 --> 00:24:34.070
  • Praying for others, giving our resources,
  • 00:24:35.170 --> 00:24:38.260
  • loving our neighbor, helping those people
  • 00:24:38.260 --> 00:24:41.060
  • that you see in your daily life.
  • 00:24:41.060 --> 00:24:43.170
  • To me, it's more than the actions, it's a mindset.
  • 00:24:45.000 --> 00:24:48.040
  • It's really seeing ourselves differently
  • 00:24:49.080 --> 00:24:52.010
  • and seeing our purpose of this life differently.
  • 00:24:52.010 --> 00:24:54.270
  • It doesn't matter who you are, young to the old.
  • 00:24:54.270 --> 00:24:57.150
  • If you are breathing, you can be a game changer.
  • 00:24:57.150 --> 00:25:00.100
  • It's pulling me out
  • 00:25:02.080 --> 00:25:05.010
  • (upbeat music)
  • 00:25:05.010 --> 00:25:07.190